EWEB Board of Commissioners — January 9, 2024

0:03 call the EB meeting to order January 9th ad do of facility and safety awareness and Logistics briefing uh thank you for attending tonight's board meeting we management subject matter experts are present in the room and virtually the meeting is being live streamed and recorded speak loudly and clearly so everyone can hear you public testimony is welcome sign up forms are available at the back of the room visitor access is limited to the board meeting room and the restrooms the restrooms are located on the first floor um exit through the right hand door front of the river across the hallway in the event of an emergencies such as a fire or security incident follow all instructions given by staff evacuation is required please calmly proceed to the near safe exit as indicated and directed by staff and evacuate away from the

0:49 building to the farthest points of the parking lots to allow clear immediate access for First Responders first up we have an agenda check no okay not seeing that so next we'll go to items from board members and general manager anybody have anything I had several items um number one could I get an update on the Kaiser slooh a project that we I think it's been two years now and just wondering where we are and why we're not hearing anything about and um just want to comment on customer service to I think you know I have a non-english speaking individual I'm helping them um the fact that we

1:35 still don't have a place people can go to and physically pay their bill that how long or is that going to be until we get that I mean I had great response from staff and everything helped him but he's intimidated by the system and you know wants to pay and like a lot of Spanish speakers do and just wonder when we're going to have that re redone with the city our expectation I believe was uh you can confirm this they're working on the the building now it'll probably be through 2024 probably late 2024 we we do have the option to make appointments for people as well so we will meet people in person if needed yeah I I appreciate that and but it's just the fact that trying to get time off work and you know and all that it's

2:21 it's an intimidating process I just told them to be patient we were going to change it but you say so may be up to another year I don't think it'll be a full year what did Matt say Karen I think it was ail may they were opened again the Matt Rodriguez like that they're in there working right now yeah that that that's great I really appreciate it thank you all I got and commissioner Brown just on the on the Kaiser slooh we do have it's either February or March we have a a state of the wed report coming up with that be appropriate time frame to provide an update and we can get something in the meantime but no you know if it's all coming at once I mean because I'm going

3:06 to ask about the the 52nd Street BM issue too so keep har onk you um I attended attended the M Kenzie Waterside Council last month uh it was after the big rain event that we had and everybody was concerned that they all the wind that they saw floating down Mckenzie was from the finrock reach restoration project um actually it wasn't all of the wood that was in finrock reach restoration pretty much stayed it actually collected a little bit more wood and the project did what it was supposed to do it spread the water out slowed it down and and had

3:51 minimal impact uh I know that when the event was going on there were a lot of people U River people that thought oh my gosh it's all wash away but all of those logs are buried down like if you see a log that's 20 ft long and out there's probably 30 feet that's buried down underneath the underneath the the river bottom so that was encouraging um they got a big year ahead Quartz Creek is moving forward um and a lot of other exciting projects so this is one of their biggest Years yet we have a a a contract in our consent calendar that I'm very excited to see imp so is

4:48 input so welcome to the public input session for this meeting this portion of the agenda is dedicated to providing community members an opportunity to address the board about any EB topic or issue we respectfully request all speakers to adhere to e web's public input instructions and code of contact that are provided during the sign up to speak process code of conduct um up on the board as well at this time we have three in oh no we have uh five in-person speakers sign up to provide testimony and we have three callers and the board was provided were we provided

5:34 um when your name is called you have three minutes to provide your comments and I will open the public session now going to have the people that are on the phone speak first so first up is Kathy ging followed by naen Scott followed by Mark Baker so Kathy ging are you okay can you hear me oh now we can hear you thank you okay I I picked up the phone Kathy gang um Kathy Cathy gang.com if anyone wants to be on the local smart meter email list uh for families for safe technology Alternatives exist to installing meters on those who do not

6:20 want them I sent you several pieces of information today you could have the meter reader come out quarterly or annually you could do the monthly you could do the monthly average like uh people do who don't want to pay a Big Bill uh in the winter and thanks to the all volunteer board that should be paid um I'm bringing up an analogy with a book by Herman Hessa Master of the bead game Joseph connect which means service has to juggle the Arts and the Sciences trying to integrate with the business World GM Frank Lawson has a difficult task leading a rate payer owned u ility in a turbulent climate energy World juggling multifarious directions he

7:06 rightfully would be stressed but a major flaw in his tenure has been neglecting quality public input like a Citizens advisory committee for her regular Town Hall meetings and quality meetings with energy Pros Realtors and other stakeholders about public concerns citizen input has essentially been put on lockdown a tragic flaw of his otherwise commendable leadership eweb refused families for safe Tech requests that pros and cons about Smart Meters be disseminated via media website with input by med practitioners techies and citizens who have experienced EMF harm eweb totally refused involvement and

7:51 overtures from family for safe Tech in fact forbade us to meet with him any more because one person who is actually lawyer and a realtor was acting outrageous in the lobby one day the result has not only been a decade of growing concerns about health issues about from EMF sensitives but also by kids pets even trees harmed but not understood or acknowledged no factual article has been appearing in the local press fires have been caused in Portland and put smart meter fires explosions in a search engine to find that whole time you know have burned have uh some of those fires been started by for Smart Meters I think so another eweb failure

8:36 was to neglect focus on buildings as energy factories reducing demand side opportunity um a 37-year realtor I finally understand how shortsighted utilities have been and not considering home as energy power plants not monitoring homes for the falling insulation not providing sufficient economic and especially the inflated costs pre uh prevent people from doing this not working with Realtors to understand electricians and Pest and P Pest and mold inspectors should be involved before weatherization occurs none of this is in a discussion there is no eweb statistic that I found today that I could refer to about homes that need

9:21 reinsulated in Amazon and another homes Z thousands of dollars damages have occurred due to rodent damages house wiring has been affected mold has occurred and yet eweb has no interest apparently in making sure that a whole package gets put together so there's a lot more I can say but I do appreciate the work you all are doing but you need to do it better thanks a lot nothing May and Scott are you on the line Scott if you're there we can't hear you

10:06 after Scott I have Mark Baker by Cindy Alex the line okay great have three minutes so is this naen do I have to naen or Mark Baker this is Mark nen Scott yes you're up okay naen Scott my name is naen Scott I'm an eweb rate payer and a homeowner on leeberg lake and a real estate broker I read your leeberg project decommissioning update of January 8th my question is why

10:53 are we destroying everything we already have in place instead of maintaining it for a fraction of the cost eweb could donate the dam and Bridge to the state or the county and have them maintain it eweb estimates the cost to just destroy the dam at about $35 million of your bigger plan of $221 million the dam in the bridge and Road could be repaired for a fraction of the costs about $15 million versus the destroying it for a cost of 35 million building a new road would cost 15 25

11:38 million tourism and businesses would continue to thrive home values would continue the increase handicapped fishing access would still be available which is a tourist attraction water sources for fire retardation would still be available emergency services and evacuation routes would be continued eweb could give State and County the 15 million to repair the road and maintain it for several years to come in eweb would save their rate P $20 million key point I'd like you to

12:24 consider the dam was built in 1928 it's a historical Landmark the bridge and Dam is the only Ingress egress for homeowners on leeberg Dam Road and the Fish Hatchery roote emergency response evacuation Home Health Care all depend on Ingress erress of the road on the dam there is no alternative route tourism is the main economy for the McKenzie river valley lot of businesses and revenue would be devastating leeberg Fish Hatchery is a huge tourist attraction loss of property values we

13:09 purchase property on leeberg Lake because we want to live on a lake loss of property from erosion and loss of water R contamination of wellwater while dismantling the dam in the bridge environmental impact on the land a river and water that was your three minutes if you have more to send you send that to us in an email thank you thank you all right markk Baker followed by Cindy Allen followed by Lisa oxman Mark Baker are you

13:58 available are you there we can't hear you if you're can can you hear me now he you now thank you great my name is Mark Steven Baker I um I work for Microsoft for uh 19 years uh and one of the areas that I worked on or the prime are that I worked on was networking in about half that time I worked on uh Wi-Fi mobile broadband and and other uh Wireless Technologies can you speak up just a little bit it's a little challenging for us in the room to hear you I want to make sure you're thank you okay should I start again just continue where you're

14:44 at okay um I originally worked with a number of other uh uh community members experts in in in uh techn technical Fields as well as medical Fields uh to uh uh to uh convince eweb to use a slightly different uh technology for their uh remote uh meter program which was again adopted uh to minimize the amount of uh stray EMF that was um which you really should consider

15:29 pollution which would be dumped into the community um there are a number of uh Scandinavian countries pretty much have decided that 10 to 15% it it varies between five and 15% of the population is EMF sensitive um and so there should be some safeguards to Pro protect those people who are AMF sensitive and the the current uh remote uh metering program that eweb has allows homeowners or Property Owners to opt out of the uh remote sensing program that requires

16:17 EMF um eweb is in the process of proposing a change to that I am not in favor of that change I don't think that we should install EMF meters on households that don't uh that don't want it um there are other ways to record uh meter readings periodically and estimate uh the readings in between that's often done by utility districts for water U and it seems to me that's P perfectly reasonable for electricity if if eweb wants to adopt uh uh time of day rates then meters could be installed that

17:02 don't have uh don't don't have EMF that would allow you to still gather the uh information needed to charge different rates for different times so I just wanted to mention that and then another completely different area Baker sorry that was your three minutes but if you have more to share with us please do send an email to us okay yeah I was just going to complain about the payroll box that's down by the original the older uh eweb house headquarters that it's just too flimsy and it's you know I'm I'm reluctant to use that to put mail with a check in because of that thank you very much

17:49 thank you next up we have um in the room uh Cindy Allen then Lisa oxman and then Sabrina seagull and a Eugene medical Advisory Board spent 18 months researching the medical lature on the biological effects of RF radiation an 84-page report summarizing their findings was presented to the board and as part of your record the 2hour Power Point presentation to the eweb board of their research can be found on YouTube under Dr Paul Dart eweb

18:36 Smart Meters health hazards some of the effects of RF radiation include increased inflammation EEG changes to the heart and the Brain altered immune function obesity altered endocrine function including melatonin needed for Sleep damage to the DNA increased rates of cancer Etc the World Health Organization classifies RF radiation as a 2B carcinogen in the same category as lead DDT and asbestos worldwide many groups organized regarding Smart Meters our local Eugene group families for sa safe Technologies

19:21 gave each eweb board member a copy of the award-winning documentary take back your power the pro program can now be watched free line in it the former prime minister of British Columbia the attorney generals of Illinois and Massachusetts General David Petraeus former director of the CIA doctors lawyers judges and others view serious concerns about Smart Meters concerns regarding health fire cyber security risk infrastructure cost higher bills vulnerability of a centralized grid to solar flares and hacking there's ample documentation of malware chips being founded components made in China and the security necessity of americanmade

20:07 components our local group sponsored the producer Josh Joel soul in a Eugene program and showed his job G we also sponsored programs with other well-respected R experts D matac over and Dr Martin Paul videos and audios of these events are part of our E Record we've also spoken to the board many times and sent countless email uh documentation eweb publicly owned both eweb and epod voted for opt out options regarding Smart Meters yet recently people who sent in certified letters they don't want a smart meter received notification about its installation on their homes opt out means no smart

20:59 meter Lisa oxman evening my name is Lisa oxman today is January 9th and this is a letter of liability you're receiving it from Lisa oxman at 345 East 34th Place Eugene Oregon 97405 my account number is listed on the letters I will provide you to all eweb Commissioners including John Brown Sonia Carlson Mindy schlosberg John barosi and Matt mcra please excuse me if I have not pronounced your names correctly also the general manager Frank Lawson de above

21:46 stated this is a notice of nonconsent to installation of any Wireless smart metering device Lisa oxman hereby prohibits any electronic or Wireless metering device Hereafter referred to as a smart meter from being installed in or at my residence of 345 East 34th Place Eugene Oregon 97405 this letter acts as formal notice and any liability for damage or harm resulting from these conditions being violated rests with the recipients of this letter the meter manufacturer and any subcontractors involved in smart meter

22:31 production installation and operation by eweb home owners have the ultimate authority to decide what technology is installed in their homes not utilities whose government protected Monopoly prevents residents from choosing a competing utility provider smart meters are surveillance devices and violate our Fourth Amendment right to privacy in our homes which is guaranteed under the United States st's Constitution all portions of the political Spectrum agree it is about individual freedom of choice and Resident owners basic property rights Smart Meters have been called into question as fire hazard and such devices have been responsible for fires

23:17 explosions and other serious safety problems Smart Meters have caused documented health problems the bursts of RF radiation emitted by their antennas considered by the World Health Organization to be a class 2B carcinogen Smart Meters typically overcharge and inaccurately represent usage when compared with reliable accurate analog meters smart meters in the smart grid risk security and reliability of the electricity Supply by opening a new portal to hackers and others who wish to disrupt these services this is a major cyber security problem created ated by smart meters for these reasons but not necessarily limited to these reasons I

24:03 require only analog electromechanical meters without electronic internet components to be used in connection with this account you can read the rest of letter since I've run out of time but I am an EMF sub sensitive thank you for hearing what I had to say M I would like to sleep at when I took the internet out of my house two years ago I began to sleep again thank you Sabrina seagull Joshua K and Sandy

24:53 opportunity be respectful of the person speaking I contacted you I think at the beginning of the the end of 2021 and I've not heard back from anyone at eweb for quite some time uh to both assist me in my physical dilemma experiencing and being harmed by the very intense assault on my body and my families from the electromagnetic high frequency sending of smart meter wireless digital information that shoots through my home I can feel it many times a day damaging and painting my organs uh I could barely stand in my kitchen to wash my dishes or prepare

25:40 food I'm an ADA uh recognized electrosensitive person and need assistance with this it's like unlivable um I have lived in my home which I own for over 20 years and this smart meter dilemma has made my life very difficult and exhausting I have a child in school here in Eugene who's attached to his friends and so forth and I'm not able to move um and um I hear also now that you're telling folks that you want to put smart meters on everyone's home even uh the people that have opted out and um and you want to keep the radio frequency turned off but this is for those people and this is an

26:26 unacceptable idea unacceptable to many of us who are aware of the mechanics of these meters and how the dirty electricity and frequency Laden wiring will be everywhere in our houses before there are any more tragedies and they must be happening every day without knowledge of what is the cause you know um I am uh I and many others suggest that you safely wire all meters and Teck or go back to the analog meters which have worked for fine for decades the biological science that demonstrates danger to humans animals and the environment is overwhelming and conclusive EU must no longer ignore the

27:13 truth we must get on the right side of History here whatever it takes as countless beings are being harmed the wireless system works fine for machines but not for biological beings and it's deadly actually wirch is faster and more secure more efficient and uses many times less uh electricity to run the wireless experiment has failed and causes tremendous harm uh please do your own investigation and involve expert parties expert parties such as the building Biology Institute um thank you there's mountains of science you could look into

28:16 Hatfield uh my name's Joshua Korn I I've been uh involved in this you heard me on the phone for like years talking about these uh smart meters and we don't want them that's clear uh the reason we're all here now as opposed to in the past is that there's these rumors circulating that those of us that still have our analog meters and are happy with them and are keeping them are are likely being imposed by some forc uh change in meters and uh and this is not acceptable this is a public utility and we own you and we're we're demanding that we keep

29:01 our our analog meters for safety reasons now it's been over two years now since the FCC was slapped with an injunction based on their their outdated 25-year-old guidelines on what is safe for electromagnetic radiation so the obviously the courts are dragging their feet on this one but you as a public utility that is owned by us need to listen to us and you know when I when I turn on this meter here you can hear even right in this room we have dangerous levels of radiation a smart meter turn it off so you can still hear

29:46 me a smart meter puts out six up to 60 times this amount of radiation on our homes potentially near our beds where we're sleeping we don't want it and and now you know like there's less of us to come here because people don't know what's going on and and now it's you know this building's further away compared to the other room and and just the information about what's going on is just seems to be hidden I I'd also like to request if these meetings actually are recorded and broadcast that we have microphones on all of your desks and we have

30:33 microphones up here and we have cameras and it's actually broadcast in an efficient way so the people can actually be heard because this is why we're here and we we want to be heard and we want to keep our meters so thank you for and sorry pronouncing my name is Sandy and I live on maxval road and I'm a customer of eweb uh I have a friend that couldn't make it tonight and they she's been threatened by an by a notice from eweb that they were going to remove her uh

31:19 analog meter and put in the digital meter and uh we have the right of of consent or anything that affects health or infects Our Lives you guys do not have a right you do not have a constitutional right to override our civil rights and ability to reject this technology these technological advances in digital are just uh a way of saving money for rich people to make more money and turn us into Surfers and we don't like it it doesn't work me personally we've had 14 hacks our Banking and credit cards a continual stream of activity to rectify what mistakes are made and allow

32:05 and the inability to have any Security in Virtual systems electronic digital data is virtual systems there's nothing real about it it's all representations and anybody can hack a virtual representation you all will have to face the fact that digital technology is a bad endro we need to go back to analog life and have people employed and people engaged socially digital is a method to just desocialized the entire culture of this planet and factually these things cause fires can you people tell me how many fires have been caused by your uh digital uh your uh smart meters in

32:50 Eugene anybody have that data not going to comment see this is not a public meeting a public a true public meeting would have interaction between the uh citizen at the table and the uh elected officials who we are uh engaging with when you sit there blank and we just speak and then we leave and then you go on and make your decision on your own that's not democracy that is totalitarianism it's a form of oligarchy and a club that wants to rule the world it's wrong we we must have consent for these things I have an analog meter I'm perfectly happy with it it's right outside my window where I have my studio I sit there hours you put a digital meter in there I'm leaving we're GNA

33:37 move you're gonna have a movement where uh renters are going to leave uh homeowners are stuck because they bought they're bought their places that's wrong what a landlord's going to do when their tenants are leaving because these evil digital devices are screwing up their health and give a threat of burning down their house and all of their things side of we don't need that analog works fine they last forever digital uh meters I've heard you have to replace them every two or three years or software upgrade it's no good thank you I'll see we don't engage in a back and forth why we are moving through the speakers and Commissioners will have a time for comment at the

34:22 end okay Gary Hatfield my jff Alish hi there I'm Gary Hatfield and I think many of you have met me in the past I somewhat have a frog in my Thro throat so uh bear with me with that look it's pretty clear that the comments that have been made to this board in the past where there'd be U meetings up the McKenzie have really in our perspec perspective gone unheated uh nen called in earlier she left some very valid points relative to uh the dism or the

35:07 taking down of the lever Dam and subsequent liquidation of the lake but it appears to me that one thing that you folks have frighted yourself with is rely on us if you're really relying on us you might be listening to the gentleman that was just before me this isn't really the right important you folks know that when you get up here and you have three minutes and I have two I'm trying to explain to you things that are relative to the group and the community I represent 60 homes and Community uh citizens up there that pay their bills to you guys every month you're decent people but not one of you has a brain God gave a goat or the car stand up and say wait a minute you got a dam that was built in

35:53 1928 you have a bunch of people and a lot of them cried last time that they were up the river when you met with some of you were there some of you weren't they're crying to their neighbors they're asking for somebody to try to help them and quite frankly I don't know that anybody out there really wants to stand up and really look at all the money and the issues involved if you did and I think young man you're one of them has looked at it in the past I hope you don't mind me calling you that uh if I remembered your name for sure I just yelled it out I know Mr Brown over here you're a cool cool guy but we find ourselves normally at the ends of the odds of left or right but look you're good people you're on the wrong side of this one rely on us means you rely on real communication real challenges and

36:38 real digging into it Minds have already been made not a darn thing we can do about it except to express that and then the next step is to get band together and get some legal action and try to Forstall what possibly is going to H come to pass look eweb hires a lot of lawyers there going to be a lot of them aren't going to want to participate because they have done business with you in the past so you have to go outside to find somebody to do something to say wait a minute think about it but when you make your vote understand there is a list of items there that you're not giving I don't think proper process to and I said last time I was here in 1968 I was a lot younger then and I was out there doing the research for the US Army Corps of engineer and when they came out

37:23 there one thing that they said was the Lakes are part of the asset of this area and we want to preserve them I was a young man then I'm still trying to preserve leeberg Lake okay as we are the other Lakes out there and also the fact that in those days there was a different attitude and perspective relative to what we're speaking at today there's more to it than dollars and cents and thank you very much I appreciate your time it don't see me any you okay but I do think the process has to get better folks because people do care and maybe I don't want a smart meter myself maybe that's a good thing I learned tonight maybe a smart meter is not so good thank you very much for your time I do appreciate you folks I hope you know okay including

38:19 you hello I'm Jeff caliban 64 that's how old I am I get a Pioneer fishing license this year for the first time it cost me $6 that saved me a lot of money and I was proud of that I lived in Oregon for 50 years and I'm nearly 65 years old and most of that's been on the McKenzie and the last 26 of it has been on leeberg Lake five years five years old that's how old I was when I caught my first fish and it was on leeberg lake with my grandfather who one pioneered that Lake that Lake's been around forever I live on it I see it every single day you people don't I could live without electricity I can't live without water water of our well who supplies over 30 uh homes right there in our water

39:04 district and just today I got calls from people going wow we need a new secretary we're going to have to hire somebody if we do we're going to raise our rates oh no we can't raise our rates we're on fixed income we can't afford that well what happens when you people spend 31 million another 15 million and then you screw up our roads we do all that we do up there what's going to happen to our rate just before I got here I got a call from a friend he said Gee Jeff you're going to the meeting and I understand that they're going to get rid of the dam what's that going to do to me down river he owns property on the on the on the river down river I watched what happened when they drained cougar Reservoir it all landed right in front of my house it became a island there was nothing there I lived next to Tom uh wildish sorry and Tom you know there

39:52 was nothing there in that River and then now I've got a full-blown is with trees and stnags and and all kinds of things so when you let go of what's out there where's it all going to go what's it going to do I don't I just don't see it I mean what I see happening now is a is a wonderful recreation area where a ton of people come up I see kids from five years old to 80-year old women out there every day in their canoes getting their their exercise and kayaks and now what I see it's going to happen if you're going to drain the lake and you're going to have to put clams in there because what's happening is 99% of that thing is going to be nothing but clam digging water there there's going to be just I've seen it when you when you drain the lake it's just mud and we you know I'm going to have the world's longest dock I'm going to have a 50 yard dock just to

40:38 get out to the water and that's not why I bought my house I can do without eweb I can do without I love you guys and you guys save our asses every single time when the rain and the snow and limbs break but you know this is a big deal and I sure hope you know this is I'm a human being my kids grew up on that River my grandfather pioneered it we're all here we're all part of a human race and water is something we need and we need Recreation we don't need we get enough politics I don't even watch the news anymore it's not fun because it's all negative why do I want more negativity in my own backyard I should be able to at least open the door see a few ospray see some fish jump go fishing and enjoy what Mother Nature put in my yard without people ruining

41:26 it that's all I have to say like to work for them thank you thank you sir thanks je L sorry you call me whatever you want that I mispronounced names I'm uh I'm disappointed I have to start after that that's kind of I wish I would have got here a minute before him kind of on the same thing with the dam removal um I live along with McKenzie I have a three-year-old toddler we're out there every single day swimming in the river playing in the river playing in the silt the mud making cat making sand castles fishing kaying and just a wonderful place to be um my concern I'm also a scientific diver I worked for the aquarium for a number of

42:11 years volunteering and I've done a lot of scientific Dives throughout Oregon um for environmental impact studies and stuff like that I'm sure you guys know the history of the MacKenzie River Valley and the road going up 126 was actually created for the gold rush in U leeberg massive amounts of gold tons of people moving up there they creaded these roads up there to go after this gold and as we all know gold mining was not the cleanest thing 100 years ago and they used a lot of mercury and that mercury throughout throughout the whole country all these old reservoirs that mercury settles to the lowest point because it's heavy like gold these reservoirs are holding back ungodly amounts of mercury um and as much as I'm excited about the idea of salmon running

42:57 up the river and restoring the river to its native state that's that's really exciting to me however the amount of mercury that's going to be released into our Rivers is unbelievable and I don't I haven't seen any studies or any any ideas of how people are going to address that I know I've seen a similar dam removal in Montana where it costs a couple billion dollars that's billion with a be to remove all of those sediments with with toxins in them um to a to a safe place and I don't think we're going to be doing that up there I'm guessing most of that mercury that's settled behind that Reservoir is going to be washing right down into my backyard and just in my children's feet and it's the fish we're eating um maybe maybe not maybe you guys have an answer that I just didn't see it one of these

43:42 things but I believe that to be happening another issue that I haven't seen it actually came from one of your biologists that I was talking to the largest per square footage number of juvenile lamp Ray which is an a threatened species of fish largest percentage largest number of those in the planet on in the world is in leeberg Lake in those sediments those sediments created an ideal habitat for those Juvenile ampe and they'll live there for 10 to 12 years before they release and make their way to the ocean and and I don't know how that habitat's going to be replaced um so that's that's going to be huge environmental issue as well um but yeah beyond that I I wish you guys luck in figuring all this out it's going to be watching these meetings

44:27 and and that's just the environmental issue then you have these homeowners who bought these homes however many years ago who are now going to have a highway in their backyard I'm sure every single one of you who owns a home feels that pain of buying your dream home and having it ruined by something that's created progress or development or anything else I can't even imagine what it's like for these people luckily my home's protected it's in the lower flats from traffic but it's not protected from the sediments So yeah thank you for your time you guys I appreciate it concludes our public session so I will close this and I will open up to commissioner comment to

45:15 speak close your public session I have letters to give to each one of the Commissioners may I do that at this time if you can please um pass over here H can take those from you and she'll get those to us thank you great there's one from Mr too okay are there any commissioner I think You' like yeah so um I guess I just have a couple of question for staff um obviously we are pretty evenly split between um smart meters and lever Dam as so I have just a couple questions about both of those so if staff could um just reiterate what our policy is about smart meters and people opting out I know that it's been a while since we've installed any because there was a pause during the pandemic just so that people know and

46:00 that we all know what the what the options are that's the first one and then the second one um is about leeberg and I know that we're going to have a presentation later today about leeberg action plan and um I my understanding is that some of the questions that have been brought up we just don't know the answers to them yet because I feel like the the leeberg action plan is a little bit of a misnomer it's not really a plan of what we're going to do but it's a plan to make a plan for what we're going to do and we're trying to figure out what all the questions are that need to be answered so um just make sure that that is that's my understanding and shaking your head yes that that is okay so just want to make sure that people don't think that we've made all these

46:46 specific decisions about uh environmental things or or things like that like it's it's all part of a process so I'll I'll address both of those commissioner so first of all a little bit of context around the the history of smart meters um EB originally started investigating smart meter technology in the 1990s um we um continued that investigation into the 2000s in 2013 eweb formally adopted an optin um approach to to metering um that was changed in 2018 in February of 2018 we

47:31 moved to an opt out approach uh of which we redefined opt out um and eventually that worked into our policies that opt out became that we would use a digital meter and configure that in a non-broadcast listen only mode so what happens when we install a meter uh when we first install the meter it does connect to the system system it registers with the system so there's a little bit of back and forth it then goes into a mode where it is not broadcasting consumption data or interval data at that point it is simply listening um if there was a turn on kind of kind of signal so opt out is

48:16 generally it's a it's a digital meter and it is configured not to broadcast um the broadcast uh length by the way if it were is probably between 50 and 100 milliseconds um to broadcast a data if it were in the opin mode I'll jump in I have a a couple of quick questions um there was there was some talk about the analog versus the digital meters now when we first voted on this you know a number of years ago part of the problem is that we're not able to find the analog meters anymore that's still the case analog meters are generally unavailable unless you go through through some kind of surplus methodology are the primary

49:02 suppliers do not supply those anymore um in fact there's uh as of 2022 there are U approaching 120 million smart meters in the United States um it is the primary method for which utilities are gathering metering information um the utility owns the meter um and um it is a condition of service and so it's the standard across the industry including eweb and we have done research Through The Years uh that support that um I would not be inclined and I don't expect this to be a redirection from the board um re-evaluating decisions of this board and passports or other uh

49:48 utilities and best practice I mean I'm not aware of any fires that have been caused by our smart geers no we have um roughly 69,000 electric meters and 46,000 water meters we've had no incidents whatsoever uh in fact they have a heat sensor on those uh and in some cases a heat sensor actually prevents uh overload or fire Downstream from the meter in fact I know Portland General Electric was mentioned also um there was uh a b of meters that they got this is over a decade ago 10 2010 to 2012 of which they replaced a lot of

50:33 those meters and I say a lot a a group of those meters I did communicate directly with the vice president um of Portland General Electric since that time they've installed 900,000 meters without incident um moving on to the the comment about the microphones and you know we agree we want this to be a space where people can come and hear us and it can be reported and adequately um heard and broadcasted we approved a contract after some work to get that put in place what's the status of that contract for getting the room I'll have to get back to you on that I'm sorry I should have checked on that today but it should be sometime this month early next month great thank you and then um my final question is on

51:20 the the leeberg lake issue um I haven't heard about mercury in the sediment is that something that I mean I'm assuming it's part of the plan that this will be looked into but is that something that I think what the board will hear in the presentation upcoming is that um we're outlining a really robust process and there's going to be a number of Environmental Studies that take place uh as part of that process public input as part of that process um some of that is is done by eweb and so there'll be a lot of Outreach and opportunity to interact with eweb and then there will will also be a FK process which is our regulator um after that point I know that in the case of leeberg there's been several I'll say flushings of the reservoir uh

52:06 the last number of years um including when we had to redo the the roll Gates um also uh when there was the fire um that um flushed the reservoir as well um but if there is we'll certainly be testing that amongst other things um relative to the environment studies that we have to do and I'm sure leis and Mark will talk a little bit more about that later um in this meeting it's going to be a number of years worth of process and a lot of different analysis and studies that have to be completed as part of that process can I also point out that the McKenzie rivers are a single source of water and it is heavily monitored U we've

52:52 got and Karen can tell us l but there's many many things that are looked for including mer in the water but not in the sediments correct that's correct but we have flushed as general manager has talked about and we do monitor those especially in those times where um we have water events that cause the flushing in those kind so we are monitoring can I just add real quick to the um sediment understandably that um sediment management is a concern um it's a concern for us as well um we aren't going to be talking about that in depth in the presentation this evening so wanted to provide just a little bit more information um our process will require that we have um we have management and

53:39 best practices in place to ensure that the scenario that you described this evening does not actually happen we do not currently have data that suggests we have suff significantly high levels of mercury in the for siment but a testing process would presumably be required as part of um our dam removal process so more information to come on that it is absolutely on our Radar Radar and something we will be planning for in noon well the presentation talk about um um no our presentation tonight is pretty high level because many of those um components they're very detailed they're you know this is a really complicated project with a lot of details to figure out sediment

54:25 management is one of them um including the the L pre so we won't talk about that in detail tonight but it is something would be developing over the course of the next couple of years as we prepare for our application process president Carlson the other thing I'd point out and and this is relevant to both the leeberg subject and the smart meter subject is Through The Years this is not the only Forum that this board uses to interact with the public we've had a number of different types and of forums we had over TW 20 different meetings relative to leeberg um as well as U River Outreach and interaction so um I think it's incorrect

55:10 when someone says this is I get my three minutes this is not a dialogue this is not the only Forum that this board has used Through The Years on either subject um relative to either smart meters or or leeberg I I would just point that out to people that you have been very accessible um Through The Years on a number of different subjects this is just one Forum that is used we also note that you know we have the opport I mean we have the possibility to reduce the time to two minutes I just think that that's not a fair thing when we have this many people who come and they plan a particular written testimony for three minutes it's very hard last minute to try to scramble when you're not used to doing this to cut down your testimony so

55:56 that's part of the reason why I allowed us to go well over time because as a board I think that we do feel that it is important to hear PR our citizens the constituents who have come here to express their opinions so that's part of why reason why we're over time and that's okay because we wanted to hear you so thank you for coming here tonight we really appreciate your input and we have heard you right Matt thanks um so for Frank and for the rest of the board I'm hearing pretty clear that people don't want digital meters on their homes even if the wireless technology is disabled um and I feel strongly that if there's any way to provide a meter that's not enabled with Wireless Communications that we should do that I don't know that we want wa into that tonight but um I

56:42 would be supportive of at least enabling people to maintain a analog meter if it's already on their house and not insisting that we replace it if it's not still functioning anyway I um without waiting into the concerns um around Smart Meters I do feel like um trying to give people as much aomy about their decisions there is is would be beneficial so I'd be supportive of that um Joshua as um president Carlson mentioned we're currently working on the audio and visuals for this room because we recognize that it's not great for remote participants so we're trying to solve that Sandy Gary both left um Unfortunately they they were both

57:28 lamenting this format and I assure everybody that it's almost as frustrating for us as it is for you um to not have a back and forth but we do that by policy as as the president um mentioned just because it can become really cumbersome timec consuming and counterproductive for us to try and have a conversation in this format but um I am certainly available to meet with folks who have concerns and talk with you in more detail and hear your thoughts um I I think my fellow board members are in the same position we want you know we we do represent our customers and we do want to be responsive so this is a limited U format but I'd encourage you um to contact us I'm going to put my cards up on the table there um be happy to talk with any of you uh further on any of these

58:14 topics and Trey um I know it's been said already but we have some really bright Fisheries biologists and people who care deeply about water quality and environment Al pollut and Public Health on our team and I have every confidence that they will be doing everything they can to keep that sedent you know as it's released um from creating any ill effects um I I just have high confidence in this team because I I've worked with the people who are casts with this project and they're um they're really well educated really bright and really caring um but again I'd be happy to meet with you separately if you can find that to be useful that's all I have thanks right yeah president just uh commissioner McCrae just so it's clear from from

59:00 Management's perspective um it would be a policy shift to um offer an analog option of which um I would want and require of course action of course on that absolutely no understand yeah did you clarify for the record that when you talked about the number of water meters and electric meters so that's not our total meters those are the ones that have been installed the 40,000 water and the 60,000 electric those are smart meters those are smart meters on both sides it's roughly slightly over 70% of

59:45 our of our total meters and you said earlier that we haven't had any problems that's direct and then as far as the lamp ra we we addressed that issue once with ODFW when remember we had to we were having to dredge around where the salmon where the salmon fish ladders are because of s was building up and what they decided to do is just High Water Events is take tobacco and take that sediment and put it into the flow and let all that sediment nail amp ra go down the river because the thought that's the best way to protect them rather than take the settlement out and so they they've addressed that before with the lamp rays that are in in that settlement so I think I agree with Matt that that we have very highly confident help us through that challenge because um is significant thing so

1:00:38 thanks right thank you all we will move to the approval of consent calendar a anyone that would like to pull an item consent calendar moved by John Brown seconded by commissioner mcra all those or any discussion all those in favor say I pass unanimously uh any would anybody like to pull anything from calendar B I have one on number six okay we have six and seven that leave

1:01:26 and N by commissioner schlosberg seconded by mccraig all those in favor say I okay we will now turn to number six BR and then Broski actually I was six sorry you and then um I don't have a problem with number six this is a contract for the Amazon Park emergency Wells um I think this is a fabulous project um and what I was hoping is that we could find out a number that we have

1:02:11 spent in total on all of the wells throughout the community I think that's a good story to tell so being able to say we've spent 1.2 million or 2 point whatever million to make sure that we have an emergency water station set up through throughout our community is a good story so I just saw this is an opportunity ra that and get that information so I can share it with my constituents so that I'm I'm fine with M that okay you like to talk about seven um just a question I don't know if this

1:02:57 goes to Karen W um the 2.32 million accumulated total of of this wood restoration that we're putting in said it's going to be reimbursed by o how do we track that and how we're approving this amount of how and when are we anticipated to get that money back and how will we as track that be informed of that there I mean we have a pretty indepth and Deborah Hart is not with us but we have a pretty in-depth way of tracking the the numbers associated with these with these grants um we can certainly follow up and make sure that we have what what you're looking for on this one in particular I a couple million bucks is

1:03:43 you know it's it's supposed to come back from OAB and I don't know when where whatever but uh that's part of part of it then just a side our question the tribal EAS on what is that for for Mackenzie wated Council no for for the McKenzie wated Alliance so the alliance the alliance I can answer I might be able to answer this so the alliance is the the 51 whatever Organization for the council um they hired uh a staff person that is a tribal liaison that works with them on some of their issues uh so that's a new St physici that is working with them and the partners it's not just the Watershed

1:04:29 Council it's it's many partners it's upper Willam Soil and Water it's the long to uh Basin so it's just it's just a staff person that's that's we're fully funding that because it's a $772,000 contract and when we through one-time money funding a staff person is that just for this project or is that because I'm know the lamit Soil and Water Conservation service they they're set on three million bucks get rid of and I'm just wondering if we are we fully funding this position I don't think so I think it I think so either no I think I'd call on Susan she she's got the answer for you I'm sure hi good evening Commissioners um so

1:05:16 for the tribal aaz on position no we are not fully funding it it's coming from a combination of funds including um let's see we've got some oeb reimbursement coming back that we are using a little bit of the rate fee I think the Soil and Water Conservation District is also helping fund that one and the total for the tribal aison that we're pushing through right now um with this contract is only 111,000 and it's someone that we hired the tribal aison we hired in July um her name is Haley she's done a great job and she's working with the upper lamut stewardship Network which as commissioner commissioner barovsky um said earlier that is a network that includes McKenzie river trust and all of our Watershed councils that are located within the upper wamit as as well as

1:06:01 Pisa um so she's working across that and working directly building relationships with the slets tribe and the confederated tribe of grand Rond um and I'm actually going with her next week to go run up to Portland to go learn about um some of the confederative tribe of grand rods um some of their projects they're working on so that's what that one's for okay and so part of the the O re will include that money that be allocated yep correct yep we had a few different funding sources for that one a lot of people felt that it was a priority because it was something that we' been lacking was the tribal engagement and tribal participation so this is kind of a pilot project that we're doing with this position to see how well it works um and so this is the way that the tribes preferred that we engage with them as having a liaison to

1:06:46 try to work on what we'd want to do for um you know like Oak management some of our Watershed restoration projects and a bunch of different projects like that thank you number seven on consent calendar be six and seven six and seven I didn't six and seven sorry second okay uh moved by Brown seconded by verovski and I I just had one quick follow-up question that I wanted to get in before we took the vote umen the I Disappeared for a second if you could come back for just a minute thank you I'm here the contract is for five years

1:07:31 does it fund the trial is that 100,000 for five years or is that for a year uh I think this is an amendment to a current contract that started in 2022 and is going through 2027 I think right now what we have that tribal aison position for is funded for two years so she started in 2023 and that would go through um 2025 and then we'll see how it's going okay got it thank you that does that make sense okay great thanks thank you okay oh yes sorry I just wanted to add about the grants um in the state of the wed report I'm also going to have a write up of that and just to squeeze in the Kaiser slw we believe we did give an update in that in the last quarterly report and we we'll do so

1:08:21 again okay now we have a motion in a second any further discussion no okay uh let's all go to vote all those in favor say I motion passes thank you right next is the election of officers nominate Matt McRae for president second Point order yes can I can I nominate a slate of Matt McCrae as President John BR vice

1:09:07 president that's my motion have an amendment I accept the friendly right all all in favor say hi hi congratulations [Laughter] minutes behind I'm be president mcra in this election year was that a smooth transition of power or is that a good example of what we should expect in trying to demonstrate for the rest of the country what yes all right well we set a good example here

1:09:54 thanks for the vote of confidence on my fellow Commissioners and uh this year thank you you guys have your cameras on I don't have mine my computer is uh not behaving so I thought when we got to a break I would have need some help McCrae I I would like to just acknowledge um president Fon work uh this last year um at thought this board was very effective leadership is an important piece of that so former president Carlson thank you for a good 2023 thank you

1:10:44 taking uh so yeah so we're on to the Le the Leber commissioning action plan we are running behind um we have a oh I'm sorry you're right yes r on thank you um all yeah not too late you can do that um so we have the current assignments do we want to just start from that and talk about any not recollecting exactly how we did this last year what go from yeah go from what we have existing does anybody want to change their current

1:11:31 assignment so we're just going to leave the assignments as they are and the only thing that changes is that John BR each right that's the only change do we need to we don't need I would suggest a motion to retain the same liaison stands the the change in leadership liaison to the City of Eugene and then second that and then the board can formally approve that I'll move that Frank just said second all right uh any discussion all support of the motion say

1:12:22 I go ahead I do want to let you know please and let me know that uh when motions are made to say the person who's saying it um so moved by and seconded by because it's difficult for the recorder to hear and tell who the person is so got it um all right so going on to the next item which is the decommissioning action plan um 645 yeah I think that's where we're headed then

1:13:18 here all right good evening Commissioners uh I'm Lisa generation manager joining me up at the table tonight is Mark inar generation engineering supervisor and Jeremy samoji engineering planner also in the room tonight we have Adam Spencer communication specialist and Robin lady are Regulatory Compliance specialist the five of us make up the core team for the Liam commissioning we'll certainly be adding staff over time but for now this is this is the core team we're here tonight to talk about the Liberty commissioning action plan or elap for short uh the agenda this even I'll go over real briefly and then I'm going to hand it over to Mark to do the majority of the topic tonight um we'll um discuss briefly the purpose of the the ldap um

1:14:04 essentially what it is and what it isn't uh the regulatory process that we expect to follow our estimated timeline and schedule for decommissioning actions and then finally opportunities for both the board and um other stakeholders to be engaged in the process both formally and informally that I'm going to hand it over to Mark great yeah thank you Lisa and good evening Commissioners a year ago at the January 2023 board meeting uh you approved resolution 2302 which directed staff to prepare a plan for decommissioning the leberg hydro project and we are presenting on that plan tonight the leberg decomissioning action plan ldap explains what EB needs to do and how we

1:14:49 will do it require periodic updates stes because as we learn outcomes from activities laid out in the plan as we complete the various steps along the way those results may affect aspects of the necessary next steps so you have heard a lot of good questions uh already um asked uh tonight and those will continue the ldap does not answer detailed questions that it explains how we will answer those questions as we move forward so as we make decisions that resolve these details the ldap

1:15:35 highlights that we will use the same triple bottom line approach the same principles that were established for the leeberg Strategic evaluation ongoing decisions will be playing out over many years so we are memorializing the basis for decision making as a reminder for exist existing staff and board as well as to orient future staff and board members who will be participating down the road the draft um yep so that's good so the next slide uh the draft ldap presented in August indicated that there might be alternative licensing Pathways subsequent information from expert Consultants helped us recognize that there's really just one way to go at this time the more complex licensing

1:16:22 pathways are appropriate when licensing or relicensing a project where mitigation is needed for ongoing environmental impacts over 40 or 50-year operating periods decommissioning on the other hand is itself an environmental mitigation action with limited ongoing environmental impacts to mitigate once the work is complete as such it is more straightforward than relicensing or establishing a new project and to key agencies doesn't warrant a complex settlement agreement such as we developed for the kmen Smith project instead there's a relatively straightforward license amendment process that we can use to establish and

1:17:08 accomplish decommissioning basic amendment process is one that's familiar to us um this is just going to be a very complex one next slide so the final ldap is more focused in the draft but the core content is unchanged there is still a three stage consultation process which I'll discuss a bit more a couple slides EB will still be conducting intense consultation with stakeholders there's still comprehensive environmental assessments to be done and are required as part of our application and then there will still be a formal NE Nea process uh conducted by FK

1:17:54 SL so we need to prepare an amendment application and the core of the application will be a description of the proposed action there are a lot of details that we still need to determine but the high level elements are shown here removal of the Liber Dam Liber development from the license removal of the dam leaving no obstructions to upstream or Downstream fish passage removal of Relic portions of the canal to a new safe condition and allows reconnection of intercepted tributary Creeks to the river and in any locations where we cannot reconnect to the river Improvement of the canal for storm water conveyance in a manner that satisfies Burk Dam safety division's long-term

1:18:39 concerns slide there are three uh there are three stages of consultation actually I skip to SP let me talk here for just a second in uh the interdependencies um in addition to the laying out the the regulatory process the elab highlights interdependencies between parallel activities as just discussed you will be moving from the current high level understanding of the decommissioning uh to a detail detail plan via the three-stage consultation process but in parallel we will be pursuing near-term risk reduction measures to address damp

1:19:25 safety concerns that cannot wait a decade or more for approval of a license amendment to decommission uh these are some urgent items like reconnecting Johnson Creek directly to the river so that we no longer need to convey it storm water flows through an old Canal these are basically going to be fast tracked elements of decommissioning we also have transportation issues that need to be resolved the most notable being long-term access to the leeberg Dam Road Lane County decision and long-term plan for that situation needs to be accurately reflected in our application and then there's the Walterville strategic evaluation the decision whether or not

1:20:10 to operate Walterville beyond the current F license period another outcome that can affect details of the final application that we submit for decommissioning little apology there we got one slide out of order I wanted to talk about the three stages of consultation um two of those stages are performed by eweb and one is performed by the FC first phase we will socialize information about our proposed action with stakeholders including agencies tribes and the public via a variety of meetings and communication Tools in addition to to educating stakeholders and objective is to listen carefully so that we can identify any

1:20:56 missing information that we haven't recognized yet the second phase also led by eweb is to complete data Gathering package that information into a Draft application and then circulate the Draft application among stakeholders to confirm that we've closed information gaps and adequately answered questions that we've received for our stakeholders as well as identify any new issues that might have become apparent in the meantime after hearing stakeholder feedback on the draft we will finalize the application for submitt to FK then the third and final step is led by FK where they can confirm completeness of our application invite

1:21:41 public comment VI their formal need process and upon completion of their work issue an amendment order so each of those parallel activities that I described um have their own timeline uncertainties associated with them it's G to have Ripple effects on the overall decommissioning timeline this slide is just highlighting the dependencies and uncertainties before I show you a set of timelines in the next few slides each of these items will be resolved in collaboration with stakeholders stakeholders and these are stakeholders who have influence over how long it will take to resolve the issues thus there's uncertainty and what

1:22:28 will be an ongoing need to update update the timelines as we progress forward SL so on starting the timeline discussion with the risk reduction measures these are the more urgent work that's required uh to address Dam safety hazards you can expect to see drill rigs on the canal and design efforts starting in 2024 with hopes that we'll be in construction no later than 2027 on the Johnson Creek improvements and 2020 20 2028 at cogwell Creek slide with a decommissioning application development you will see work starting in 2024 to address the known data

1:23:15 gaps collaboration with the county to resolve the key Transportation issues and work advancing preliminary designs for the proposed action so that we can start formal stakeholder engagement processes in 2025 and we'll Target issuing a Draft application to those stakeholders by the end of 2027 that's followed by more back and forth consultation with the stakeholders so that we can submit a final application to Ferg by the end of 2029 we think that F's formal consultation with stakeholders on the application could take a couple of years s suggesting that we might not see a firk order on the application before

1:24:03 2032 such that actual decommissioning instruction work wouldn't be get get underway until 2032 and that decommissioning work would take at least a couple of years to complete these are all dates that eweb is targeting and planning around uh but I note again that there are key stakeholders who will influence how the timelines actually play out finally we just wanted to clarify timeline expectations for the Walterville strategic evaluation over the next couple years should position us to present the board with a recommendation by the end of 2025 which would result in either relicensing or decommissioning planning work as we approach the end of the current license

1:24:53 440 they're going to to be ongoing opportunities for the board and public to monitor progress via presentations like these I guess I have SL presentations like these um one two per year depending on levels of activity and that will include the U rer board meeting we'll also schedule workshops and submit correspondence as needed and there will be visibility via the Capital Improvement plan and onm budgeting processes as well um then finally uh wanted to touch on uh the board's involvement in key decision points we will look to the board for

1:25:38 approval of the final version of our proposed action uh we come back to you for feedback uh and also look for board approval on the Walterville decision then we would come back to the board for feedback on any changes in Baseline assumptions level Visions process um and we'll look to the board for guidance on any discretionary measures to mitigate impacts of decommissioning that go beyond regulatory requirements then finally we'll come to the board to confirm acceptability of the F final F of order throughout this process we will work with the communications team to

1:26:25 continue the great work that Adam Spencer and Jeremy smoi have been doing to get clear information to stakeholders maintaining transparency trust and confidence with both internal and external stakeholders and listening so that we can bring the board important information that we received from the stakeholders to help keep you informed and unsurprised to the greatest extent possible that are field any comments questions the so um thank you very much I'm I'm looking forward to it I'm not going to be around when it happens but anyhow um

1:27:11 question why are we still impounding water there now yes we Fe that question from a few folks and the um the issue that we have is we need to to maintain there's passage past the dam at all times kind of like the core of engineers just did they dumped all the reservoirs around here for Downstream passage for the salmonoids and if the leeberg Hatchery has got a finite life which it may even what's just happened recently um why would we continue to maintain that level and not just open it up drop it gradually and let that sediment do a natural progression we talked about that Jo not all sudden I want to make sure I'm understanding your your um your

1:27:57 question so we do need to maintain um Weber Lake um elevation so that the the flatters on both sides of the dam are functioning um correctly be open the gug well they just be able um the leberg dam actually um outside of the with outside of the fish ladders does pose an impediment to fish passage there's um velocity barriers it's it's a series of roll Gates and um while some fish may be able to pass through the gates if they were wide open um we do expect it to be a fish passage barrier so so that's why we want we need to keep the fish ladders functioning until such time as the dam is removed here thank

1:28:48 youate um thank you for the presentation I have a question about um of our messaging or the information that we're giving to the public because uh I just see time and again people coming for public comment and um there's usually um similar questions or things that are brought up and um I know that we have a whole section on our web page about major projects and decommissioning Lead just wondering about um there's a way that can present the information in a maybe more easily digestible way that um just hits on some of the the questions that we get often and so those are about environmental

1:29:34 impacts um Property Owners you know the idea that the lake is just going to be drained and what's going to happen um the road all those things that I know that we don't have specific answers yet because that's the whole thing is about but if there was just a way that we could message that these are all questions that we have too and this around this time if we could like give a estimate given the um the timeline this is when the Public's going to be asked for this information this is when Environmental Studies are going to happen just so that we can make sure that we're putting out as much information as we can but maybe in like a user friendly way because sometimes when I look through the stuff on the

1:30:19 website my eyes start to glaze over after a while because some of it's pretty technical um so anyway a comment several questions about the plan um the first one goes to some of the U River people in the and leaving the dam so we've had we've had conversations with f regarding license amendment being the way to go we have it's been presented to us as a board that that FK would not allow us to leave a dam that is not generating power is that still was that conveyed to us through FK or is that just an

1:31:04 assumption that we've made that is um an assumption it's an educated assumption um that said even if it were not a requirement by FK there are uh reasons that it would be um it would be difficult for eweb to continue to own and operate Dam that is not functioning for the purposes power I'm going to kind of what M said that would be good to be able to convey that message in a clear and and concise manner second question I have is in section 3.8 you talk about the conceptual design and that we need to get to 30% before we can really say this is have a clear picture go from 10,000 feet to 25 200 feet at what point on

1:31:51 this chart is that 30% is it at Draft application yeah so end of 2027 end of 2028 is kind of where that 30% is right and our engagement during those first phases of consultation would help us develop get some some of the indal feedback to that that's good to know the next thing I have is when we for myself when we were talking about returning the river to Natural State we talked about the tributaries and it looks like we've got Johnson Creek going back to it we also in my one of my concerns was is there a possibility of cogwell going back and right now we're looking at we're looking at it going

1:32:38 through part partially using what we have there now at what point will that analysis be done whether we can return Coxwell directly to the river and would expect that to happen during the the first couple of years of engineering refinement so as part of get that's to that 30% we want to answer that question confirm or deny that the the most viable cost effective way is through the canal versus so that question will be asked it right now it seems like it's it's predetermined but that question will be asked right it is not resolved it needs our educated guess is that the canal would be the outcome but that needs to be verified do an Alternatives analysis then La well

1:33:25 almost the last question I would have 10 seconds uh Clean Water Act 401 have we've considered the economic cost to us if if we have to do that is that built into the plan um you mean that that it would a licensed Amendment would likely trigger a 401 certification for the walth real project yes um you know there we have not put an estimate I don't think I'm looking at the team here um on the potential uh cost of the implications of that however I'm not sure we have much of a choice there right so um leeberg we need to do something with leeberg it is not a viable option for us to do nothing and any regulatory process the license amendment process is like likely to

1:34:11 trigger a 401 we have done some thinking around what the potential implications are but have not put cost estimates around that and we would see that with the Leber analysis Walterville analysis evaluation maying second round go ahead you barowski oh I just wanted to comment um and this this relates to some of the questions around why can't you just donate this this facility to somebody um commissioner barosi there's probably three reasons driving what we're doing around the dam one is FK themselves they are very unlikely to have a primary use

1:34:57 of a facility now change and not require the removal the second one is there are a number of stakeholders beyond eweb beyond FK that will push for that um push for the and FK will listen to that so as part of the stakeholder process there are a number of other government agency fish and wildlife agencies non-government agencies who will push for the D removal as part of it and then the third one is that it makes no sense for eweb to own operate maintain and deal with the risk of a stranded asset not used to support a primary Mission and so there's there's three primary reasons for um the question that that you ask um we do have this in in our

1:35:45 various FAQs stated and I and I know that we have reordered those a number of times trying to get the most common questions to the to the top I think we've heard that from Commissioners and I know Adam is back there and we'll continue to look to ways to refine our messaging one of the key things that I'm hearing and this is a number of times I've heard this from different Commissioners is not just what we're doing but when can the public provide input in certain subject areas so when on the lines would they have the opportunity to comment on Transportation when would they have the opportunity to comment uh on the the state of of different issues and so I

1:36:31 think that's something that we probably have to give some some thought to so that we can provide some guidance around yes this is an issue expect this to come to the Forefront in this year or within this window and the last thing I had of BBS do we see in here as far as appeal I mean what parts of this process are appealable or subject to litigation that may take this timeline and and move it 2050 I know that I I just don't know what parts of these of this license

1:37:17 amendment is is appealable or you know able to be litigated against which will which will push our timeline out which to me pushing that timeline out time is money right so if we push it out because of litigation or appeals five years that could be an extra 50 yeah yeah we do we do talk about um we had a a slide in here about the various regulatory risks think specific topics that's that might trigger a legal effort um and there's there are a number of them um there's uh the F even process is

1:38:05 is going to be uh the official opportunity for it to be um elevated to to F's attention and a decision associated with the concern and just just a quick note um you know litigation is possible really at any step of the way there is not a defined appeal um place but FK does you know if if FK issues an order um depending on the standing of an organization and there are different um processes that they go through go through to um have a a rehearing is how it's stated in it works um but litigation is possible at at you know at

1:38:50 any thank you I would just reiterate point about communication I know the videos that were created as we were thinking about the decision here were super helpful in distilling um key points for folks and I think that could be a really valuable way to help us relay the decisions that are made those that are coming so I'd encourage to be that way if possible great I'm sure Adam's taking not um did such a great job on that you want more even um so yeah one note uh that I wanted to to drive home is that this

1:39:35 this plan is a living document it will continue to be updated and presumably as we get closer in time to various steps we'll have more detail on specific timelines um uh decision points and opportunities for engagement thanks and uh there is action on here so do we want to uh just to approve this plan is that correct are you looking for yeah um our request this evening was for feedback um on the approach and ultimately our recommendation was for the board to approve this draft as presented knowing that again it will be continue to be updated as we move through the process to approve as

1:40:22 presented second by Carlson second by Brown discussion support say I much I know I know what you're gonna do we're seven minutes see closing the Gap next update I'm just

1:41:19 kidding yeah pres McCrae uh Commissioners good evening uh for the audio record Frank Lawson CEO and general manager along with Rod price assistant general manager U we're here this evening to uh discuss the 2024 annual organizational goals um the objective this evening uh is part of a process that's defined in board policy that really states that the board will identify what your priorities are for the upcoming year um the general manager will interpret um and try to mindmeld with the board to figure out what that looks like and present back to you for board approval uh what the 2024

1:42:05 objectives look like and that's described in in your board policy bl4 this is a really an ongoing iterative process um where we use feedback throughout the year our quarterly reporting um management uh and staff look at opportunities that we see internally we had a discussion last month with the board around some of the areas of opportunity that we see as well as what you see and we're bringing back uh some a proposal this evening for the board's consideration as far as this upcoming Year's annual objectives we're trying to align those objectives with sort of three overarching business priorities um the

1:42:53 first one is to recognize that um our our mission our ongoing 247 365 mission is to provide um essential services to our community we recognize that and see that as an important part of what we do day in and day out and in fact a pre-requisite to the Strategic Pursuits that we have positioning the utility going forward um the optimizing energy delivery as well as resiliency those are both identified in the Strategic plan that um this commission has worked on throughout a number of years oftentimes we have referred to those as the two big ones um one really centered on energy

1:43:39 the other centered on both Water and Electric delivery going forward in your packet there were seven goals uh that were presented for 2024 um these are not the full text um I we do have the full text available in in the slide deck in in case Commissioners would like to get into specific wording um again the first few um ongoing operational effectiveness this is about continuous Improvement this is a prerequisite for a lot of our strategic Pursuits um we also uh understand and as part of that the second goal recognizes the ever increasing compliance

1:44:26 obligation that we have as an organization not just in things like Carmen Smith but also in things like water Master plans organ health authority requirements um as well as OSHA nerk I there's a number of initials that I could um present to you but it's an ongoing obligation we also have an on-site nerk audit this coming year as part of that last month it was mentioned uh the ongoing Workforce requirements uh the board brought that up uh something that we recognize uh we're taking a little bit of a a plan du check act approach to that uh where we're doing a

1:45:12 deeper dive into the assessments of both the workforce as well as the the market uh that we're we're trying to tap into to or develop and so uh this particular goal identifies both the assessment of that and also developing some initial actions uh that we feel like we can pursue um to really ensure the resiliency of our Workforce um going forward the the sap work really EES is pretty foundational for uh both our continuing business operations as well as as our future uh strategic positioning in particular the Dynamics of which we're going to get into relative to the next goal which is to start to launch into

1:45:58 rate design uh is particularly important um as as part of that and then um goal number six centers around of the integrated resource planning work that we did this last year I think as uh commissioner Carlson pointed out last month many of these sort of continue to build upon themselves a strategic some things will come and go through time but none of these should really be new uh to Commissioners as they've been part of what we've been developing and the pieces that we've been putting together uh for the organization and positioning us going forward the last one is a recognition that there's um an opport opportunity that we need to be very intentional with around Federal

1:46:45 funding we want to make sure that we're aligned strategically with the opportunities and we've developed a process to vet that um accordingly um not just chase money but go look for opportunities that relate and and either support our um business priorities or our strategic work when you look at how these goals do align with our business priority they're fairly well balanced um across both the maintaining and improving our operations our uh Energy Delivery optimization and also our resiliency different goals have different impacts um accordingly um but

1:47:31 feel like they pretty well represent the fact that we are addressing in our business priorities with our 2024 annual objective I'm not going to read this um we do have this is really for reference uh you have it in your packet the specific statements of the goal um one through seven and then one thing that I did want to touch on just briefly um was the fact that um one of especially the first goal but all of these these goals um our plan is to come back um as early as next month um with a term that we'll start to coin we we have various nicknames for charts and and uh

1:48:17 different tables um we'll call this the bowling chart what this will represent is and and then this maybe a little bit hard to see within each goal we will identify specific metrics or measurements or Milestones that we're going to track throughout the year um typically monthly or Milestones that may occur intermittently and whether we're on track as an organization as we work our way through the year uh typically there's what's called a jump off point that's where you're beginning there's an annual objective where you want to finish the year and um as an organization as a leadership and executive team will'll be reviewing as we go um throughout the year where we

1:49:02 stand um on those particular metrics but those will not emphatically um explicitly stated in the goals those we will bring back um should the board approve the goals this evening we will then bring back as part of our reporting uh what we're using to uh to prove to you that we are making progress um on those goals as we've progressed throughout the year with that this is an action item so we would propose either that you move to adopt these annual goals as developed um by both you and us um or that you make a motion to approve those with some sort

1:49:48 of inserted Amendment should the board feel like there's something that you wish to change with that President McCrae I'll turn it back to you um thank you I I think these are all modable goals that we we worked on and and need to continue to work on um and and I'm sure they're in there in the seventh in seven part of of these are part of these but where would our climate goals live in these seven and and specifically what bowling chart are our climate goals going to land in I

1:50:35 can see them Landing in a few but I didn't see it really identified in our in our goals going forward but I know it's something that we've worked on quite a bit Yeah U commissioner barowy one of the things I I meant to point out and I and I really didn't uh do that um all of these goals are preferenced by this statement at the top which says consistent with board Direction policies business priorities and organizational values we will pursue these we will pursue those in that context so they will either appear as an explicit item that we're tracking as part of that or they uh provide the the guide posts as we pursue that that goal and it's not just

1:51:20 the U the item related to say sd15 our climate goals but also our Dei work and all the other board policies and so those will be reflected one way or another either in the bowling chart but all of these goals have that as a premise that we're going to pursue these goals in the context of the guidance that you've provided you I wanted to ask about the when I when I look at the seven I don't know where Second Source falls into that you see that we have the three business priorities but again I don't see water as a key priority so to hear your

1:52:05 thoughts yeah so the um under the first objective um we have specific um measurements and Milestones around our type two and type three projects um the uh that particular project that you mentioned is a type three so it would get its own special attention um the as well as things such as a a water master plan would be that so um it's not ex sort of separately stated but it's recognized that anything that's a type two or type three which has strategic significance is monitored as part of that so it's in that section and not the resiliency section although just cross

1:52:51 over yeah it has it has more than one benefit resiliency being a key piece of that the 2024 annual additional goals developed by the board in sta for that sure second lber second by Carlson any discussion

1:53:36 yeah uh we're almost two hours in um I know we have one more item before our break people want to break now or want to go to the next item break now that would allow me to get my computer fixed too if that's all right can we take 10 minute break

2:02:01 I'm sorry we still have twoes jum the gun

2:03:05 wood president McCrae um sorry excuse me um Commissioners good evening um for the record again this is Frank CLA the CEO and general manager with me is Kira Hutchins who's our human resources manager the objective this evening is to provide opportunity for Commissioners to add additional criteria to my performance evaluation uh for this coming year as as part of what was described uh in a memorandum and discussion from Kira back in September for a little bit of background um there are really three areas that kind of govern uh the general

2:03:52 manager's relationship with the board there are certain board policies B5 in particular describes evaluating the general manager's performance um relative to established goals and priorities again there's a little bit of back and forth in the language where I have to find a way to mind meld with the board and understand what your priorities are reiterate those back to you um in the form of of goals of which we just went through uh the process um there's also a mention in there of particular metrics around the performance um of the general manager relative to policies directions goals Etc the other one is the amended general

2:04:41 manager employment agreement This was um this was signed um by then president Carlson back in 2019 U that that talks about certain aspects of compensation being aligned with uh our non-represented employees uh prior to that the general manager um alignment between compensation and performance was really a sort of discretionary process with the board um the intent of that particular Clause was to keep the general manager compensation relative to a base level of performance in line with regional comparators U and the general manager contract also describes the fact that

2:05:26 the board will evaluate the general manager on an annual basis more recently recent practice also um is something uh that at least in my tenure with the board has been centered around uh the fact that I consider my own performance not just about what we are accomplishing as as a team as an organization but also how we're going about doing that uh we explicitly say for example in the Strategic plan and also in board policy that our values really dictate how we're pursuing what we're pursuing um and so I consider that

2:06:11 uh personally an important part of of not just what we do but but How We Do It um we've also made some changes even relative to things such as the state of the utility report uh historically that was given by the board president Conor to the public um we changed that a couple years ago so that that's one mechanism uh for which the general manager reports to the board and to the public here's The Good the Bad and the Ugly of of the organization and where we're at um as well as a a detailed uh self- evaluation that is part of this process um what we what we added

2:06:56 formally uh in uh pah's Memo from last September is that human resources will do an internal survey uh with some of my direct reports and and others and provide that uh to me and I will summarize that to the board um in my self- evaluation um as part of that as part of that process um the this evening is is the opportunity um and the question for the board is are there things other than the Fulfillment of the goals that we just went through and how we how we tght that's and pursue those again not just what we're pursuing but the method of which we're pursuing those

2:07:43 um that the board would want to add criteria to my performance for this upcoming year this is an opportunity for the board to to discuss and identify what those areas might be and so with that um president McCrae I'll I'll turn it back over to you and and sit back and listen and enjoy this be fun thanks Frank questions I we've gone through this process a number of times and I know that you know during the course of the time that I've been here we've refined and modified it and I don't have anything at this point to change

2:08:29 necessarily we will recognize that every time we go through it it's a very awkward process and uncomfortable and I think that's just fortunately the nature of the beast but I do like the um the structure that we've set up I still believe that it's the right one for the organization and for the position at this time but I'm open to others thoughts if others have you know tws and CLS here um at this point for this year I'm tring this process and um I do know every year I feel like kind of flip-flop a little bit about like should we add this or what is it going to look like I don't know it always feels a little confusing

2:09:15 to and I'm just wondering um so not for this year but I'm wondering if this could be like a Bo not a board goal not like a strategic goal but I would like to learn more about how elected bodies conduct um performance reviews because I know that we've gotten information from internally here at eweb but I really am curious about what what do other organizations do and what is best practice out there because it is super awkward but I think it doesn't have to be so awkward um so that is something I would like to look forward to for the following year is maybe maybe maybe as a board we get some training around that or there's some kind of webinar or something that we can attend just to see

2:10:02 how it's done elsewhere I'd be happy and and ask as C way as well um I will say when it comes to Chief Executives there's a wide range of different approaches to it um I think what um has been particularly helpful for me and and and I know that this this is something that's going to have to survive the individuals involved including myself going forward um and I know that um pre meeting um commissioner Carlson asked um about certain roles in the job description there's certain aspects of that um I I think your question was is it represent you know what do I think of of the job

2:10:47 description um I I think it would be a lot more Awkward if the general manager wasn't performing the organization wasn't performing um as opposed to to now um I also think that when I look at the job description it's it's an area for the board to start and maybe this year when we when we do the performance review that Kira reiterate that job description so the board can go down and say how am I doing in some of these sort of critical critical areas um I I'll tell you it's not just something where I look at a static job requirement I think the those of you

2:11:34 that I've worked with for a number of years in particular there are certain years where there's certain different emphasis um some years there might be a lot of public Outreach sometimes there's internal work then then there's Co covid which is more of a of a how do we operate in in normal day-to-day operating environments so there's a little bit of a difference um I I can tell you 2024 for me is going to be um sort of personally about how do we develop strategic de strategic muscles in the organization so that our strategic plan which is now a 2018 through 2028 how do we start to develop the muscles in the organization to build the

2:12:20 next plan and that isn't just a oh here's a plan but how do you develop the process so I'm I'm look I each year I've had my little secret spreadsheet where I've had my own reval anything here my secret notes that I've said this is something that I'd kind of like to be working on this year um like I said it's varied year to year so and I know many Commissioners some years we've had like tons of Outreach and seems like a neighborhood meeting every week and and then there's other times when I'm spending more time on a regional basis than I am local I mean it does shift a bit um but I I think um one of the suggestions I would have when we go through the process in March March is

2:13:08 that yes there's a results piece of it there's a process piece to that and then there's also here's the here's the General job description and are there gaps or things within that that that you see but it it does vary and you can you can weigh out I know you've surveyed other it does it varies widely across different agencies or isn't generally consistent I guess the thing that feels a little awkward or or somewhat difficult is I think that this is the biggest our biggest responsibility actually it's overseeing the general manager and making sure that that it's that the general manager is in line with what the board wants um and in some ways all of

2:13:53 our other Duties are we listen to experts talk about things and we ask questions and we vote but in this kind of acting like HR people a little bit I know that you're giving us all the information or you're get Gathering it but like there is kind of a HR component to this task and maybe some people know more about few job performances but I'm just saying like as a board just feels like it kind kind of a different function no on the elog board we've done a number of reviews we do a review every year and within that organization they have done some some years they've done a 360 review some years they've gone out and

2:14:39 done surveying of the other agencies and partners with the that they interact with sometimes it's only been a survey with the internal um staff management staff and the board members um and you know in each way they you know run the gamut of it whenever we decide to do what I want to advocate for is making sure that we pick the process and we're very clear with Frank and what that process looks like for the next year so if we want to make any changes to that for when we do the review because it's always in retrospect um that that if we make it we make the changes to the following year so you know what to expect

2:15:33 question one I have a question on the 360 review um is that Anonymous the stakeholder survey yes it would be the responses would be compiled okay good um and then you you mentioned that it was from the key report how far I guess one of my questions is is how does the general eweb worker be able to give us input on how they feel about how the general manager is is working and I mean I I I don't think we need to do a 360 to every single employee but is there a way to

2:16:18 dig down on that because I mean I've got a pretty good feel on how I relate and how I feel he's doing his job but I'm not in a bucket truck tonight in the rain finding out how I how I feel about how he's doing his job and and to me that is something that would be helpful and and I don't know the mechanism to get that or if that mechanism is in place um but that's information that I haven't had in the process going so so far we get 360 from Rod and Deborah and and that type of people that are direct that have direct access to you but I also would like to know what the the general

2:17:05 line person and Frontline people work feel about how the how you're operating and I don't know mechanism to get that I I'll just say there's there's no mechanism at the moment um I also think that the way that the the contract is structured um is one where um the the basis for salary and compensation and and that has been sort of re disconnected from that process um I I will tell you that not just myself but the rest of the executive team um we started last year an employee engagement

2:17:51 survey um now Employee Engagement is different than employee satisfaction and by the way I'm glad you're not on your new truck right now um and and there I I think when you have an organization of 550 to 600 people it's a little the relationship with the general manager is a little different right um and so the organ so there isn't necessarily a direct linkage now we use that information to guide a lot of the things that we do around Employee Engagement and how we're leading as an executive team just just an example the the impact

2:18:37 of hybrid or telework for example now there's a part of the organization that absolutely hates it and they think it's destroying the company there there are other people in the organization that love it it's lifechanging um they're in a position where they can take advantage of that and we are in a position where we can use that for Effective retention and recruiting um so there are different different elements that that we use in the organization to improve but that's that is it's a little bit different relationship with your chief executive um when it comes to personal performance um now we use those I'll just say we use those internally as part of our process regularly but there's no

2:19:22 direct way at the moment for Frontline worker to that could it could it be implemented into the 360s from your direct reports that one of the questions is how does your working group what is what is your working group's feeling towards it so it kind of does go up through the chain I don't know again it's just if if I'm out of bounds wanting to know that information I understand that but to me that's something that that is you important I've I've done evaluations with other other boards and and commissions that I've been on and and it like s said it runs the

2:20:08 gambut but you know it's members comment so I don't think we should bu like that deep because there's so many most of the people don't directly to Frank there's so many layers in between and they don't necessarily know about his job I mean your job Frank is to lead the whole organization but um somebody might not like their job for some reason that might have nothing to do or they might love their job but they don't really know they don't know Frank so I don't know how much um information we would get but I think it could be interesting for us to get summary of those employee engagement surveys just

2:20:55 to see like what your what people in the organization think and you know the first year it'll just be information to us but each year as we can kind of compare just to see how people are engaged but you think that's an important me I I absolutely think that the sort of the culture and the Persona the attitude of the organization and important it's reflective on on the leadership and myself that um I I will say that in in our first effort at at um the employee engagement survey we used an outside organization so that there is a baseline not just with eweb but with other organizations um General organizations not utility specific but um and and there is

2:21:42 certainly a dynamic that takes place where the further you get away from your workg group The more you don't like or don't trust you know so within people's work group they really feel good about their work they trust their colleagues they trust their supervisor a little less they trust their manager even less and those darn Executives who knows what they're doing so there's a there's a bit of a um a distance Factor there now it's not out of line for other organizations our size um but um we'd be happy to to share that we're doing another one starting in a couple weeks so we'll have a baseline from last year to this year um and so um I think we'll have the

2:22:29 results by the time that comes around to my review I'd be happy to share that as sort of a pulse of the organization for the board I think it' be that be certainly appropriate and similar I mean we've done customer surve as well right and we we want to share that with the board also yeah been doing this for a while and I'm not a believer in change for the sake change if there's something to me that I feel that we're not doing or should be doing I promote I think what doing is just right as far as my ability to evaluate to get down to the level you're talking about my first started here we had strike wasn't pretty and there was a lot of dissension amongst the people but since then we've had 15 years of successful negotiations with Union and non-union people the

2:23:15 professionalism by the staff and way they take pride in their work to me that all reflects a degree of satisfaction of how our leadership is doing and so those are metrics that I look at and and I I agree with Mindy that about getting too far down into that you and we're not technically we're not supposed to have contact with people outside you know you're not supposed to go out the street and say hey what do you think about this uh but so that's that's the way I do it is I I look at where we've been and where we are and you know we've got pretty demanding the unions are those are challenges K and and and everybody congratulations they we've not had labor issues we've got professionalism up front and uh the pride of ownership I see a I've been

2:24:00 living this construction project downtown for two years e a major part of it and just a professionalism the difference between the ewb crews and the other cre Crews is light year is different and that's because they like their job it's a career it's not just a job and so I think that is from the top down and so to me I I I'm very satisfied with the input I get through those observations appreciate that but it's really the other way around the organization is making me look good instead of so you know um the same with the the union negotiations um all all those are reflective both of Union and membership and Leadership thereof and also the members of the eweb

2:24:46 team many of you know Karen and and Rod and Kira being well some others being really significant parts of that and so I think if there are areas when we get to the point that the board is particularly interested in um I would be happy to research or share the the areas of opportunity the strengths of weaknesses as as I see them I know that that's from my perspective and I think um as as commissioner McCrae as pointed out a couple times that this um whatever system sometimes has to go beyond the individuals that are here now we I think we're highly functioning group um but we also have to set this up so that if it wasn't that way that that there are

2:25:32 certain things that can happen and in fact board policies are set up that way also if um for example whoever is the chief executive in in charge of Workforce Services or HR whatever the the equivalent title is has direct line to the board both on evaluation criteria as well as if there's there's issues with the general manager and the same holds for the Chief Financial Officer and for some reason there's there's worries that I'm uh participating in mismanagement of public funds in some way that this board has direct line and authority to meet with the Chief Financial Officer so there's there are some protections built in

2:26:17 I just um to follow up on that a little bit because I I I think what you're asking is what is the employees perspective of Frank perhaps and and so the the position description is is pretty clear about the the role of general manager and how it um for delegates and then from there the the Frank's job is to to take that and and delegate to to the U utility as a whole right and so um um you're probably not going to find what you're looking for to commissioner schlossberg's point that if you go to individuals you're not going to see what you're looking but I think um U commissioner Brown talks about the the values he's seeing demonstrated

2:27:03 right you see the the staff come up you're seeing the the reports all these things that that have been put in place and are translated through the values I think you're seeing demonstrated through these kind of things and so I think you are getting the Aggregate and and pretty solid opinion of of what people feel about the organization and how Frank's leading so to me that's kind of how this is set up Effectiveness it's not a popularity contest because I I can speak from my point of view now um failing after you know I'm not always popular so okay but does that mean we're not effective

2:27:54 least you're not popular but effec but he's popular and not effective that I didn't say that I say wow I've been called a lot of things twisting of words thanks R um I agree with Sonia that uh it's important that we be consistent and fair to you in terms of our methodology being the same I actually feel like the methodology we're using is the is really pretty good uh given that it's it's still awkward but I think there's not much way to avoid that um I'm most interested in the feedback from your direct reports and so I'm really grateful that we're doing some Outreach to collect feedback from that group and is that correct here the direct reports primarily that stakeholders stakeholders Frank okay

2:28:41 yeah that's super helpful there's certain sorry to interrupt I'm trade there it's direct reports so Executives then then as well as some of my sort of Jason cuser for example is a direct report so there some of those and then there's certain managers that I work with more than others so it's kind of conglomeration of that group I have historically done this um myself um and not aggregated for example that that kir is talking about but I I've done it confidentially at times sometimes not confidentially and typically ask two or three different questions you know what am I doing that I should keep doing or

2:29:27 do more of what am I doing that I should stop doing or do less of are there things that I'm missing that you think I need to know these are things that I've historically asked she's now as of the memo in September formalizing that process in an anonymous way yeah I from my perspective that changes what you're likely to get not the people will be direct and honest with you but there are some folks who you know may change their feedback to you just based on the fact it's going to you so the fact that it's going to Cura to me is super helpful um I do wonder if we can just get the results the anonymize summarized results from Kira um I I'll attach those unedited my report and then um then then

2:30:14 if there's any context I need to add all add on top of that I won't I won't slice it or filter it sounds great I really appreciate that effort to make that happen so uh with that then are do we do you have what you need it sounds like um maybe you had a question about some thinking for next time and training do you want to make a if other people are interested but it sounds like people are satisfied with the current would well I I agree with you like I I feel like I could do this better and I I agree with you that it's the most important thing that we do as a board um would a training I mean maybe even just

2:30:59 an hour with Kira to think about you know how do we provide effective feedback and and how do we you know how do we better calibrate our our feedback so that it's most useful for Frank would it be helpful to do that between now and March is that realistic and something that we want I can't I will speak for there's a couple different ways to do that um we can do that in the the two onone sessions like we've done with a lot of things and time could be flexible around that if the board wanted to do it as a group we could either take agenda time or work session time um to do that um but if the

2:31:44 board feels like um you can tailor for individual groups that that would probably be more flexible within the window you're talking about so great Sonia and then car BR the one thing that just does bring up in terms of the timing aspect of it I know it's always awkward when begins and then they're immediately thrust into this process because it's in March we will miss critical feedback from the commissioner two at a time depending on how Cycles going so I don't know if there's any interest in ability to change the timing in the future but it while because the new person coming

2:32:30 in is is completely ineffective at getting PR commissioner Carlson what we could do as part of of any exit with the commissioner is do uh a debrief U from that commissioner um on my performance prior to their departure um the timing is set up pretty well because we had have annual objectives there's um a close out time where we're closing the books we're going through our financial audit there's a number of things so that the timing was specifically chosen for that reason but if um if there is a concern that we're missing some perspective uh

2:33:16 from a commissioner that's departing um we we can certainly be brief with that commissioner um around the time of departure sure we're not missing anything we adding their comments as one of the group right eventally to the saved and that that sense got it will happen ind's looking for I mean I think for me what was represented here the information that we're going to get I would just assume go through the process with what we have here and see how it works this time and then at that you

2:34:01 know not try and Rush something through for our evaluation it's like let's do this let's do this year's one and if we see that we want more at that point maybe then then direct staff to to do the the engagement but I think for me getting getting the information that we talked about here the survey or the the 360s and those types of things might be enough that it smooth it Smooths it out and it might be good enough or if not then we have time to implement it before next year that's my points I'm confused because I heard somebody say that is Frank getting what he wants from us I mean as far as feedback the only one person who can answer that's Frank and Frank needs

2:34:47 something to turn around and say um I you know we're not communicating we're not doing it right LS or two kid or whatever um Frank's got to say that we can't say that at least in my opinion we can't say that if if he doesn't like the way this process is working then he needs to say that and I haven't heard him say that and so if you you want more from us if you want more feedback more Deep dive then say it and if not and we're satisfied with process and I'm like John I'm I'm ready to to move on with the process we have but if you want more from us or you think we're not doing it tell us I don't want you to no I'm just just I know that we can't answer it I I've

2:35:34 heard um things that I'm comfortable with commissioner Brown um I think the board is is interested in not just my relationship with the board about my relationship um with my direct reports and how the internal uh operation is is U progressing and I'm I'm comfortable with that um the this particular timing associated with the goals what I haven't heard is that oh we also want to measure you on this XYZ met metric that goes along with um something that's different than um what we're pursuing as an organization and how we're pursuing it so I I didn't hear any kind of student

2:36:19 body left associated with that I heard yes we're interested in your relationship with your Executives direct reports as part of this process I'm comfortable with that um and um I I think if I need something from the board I come to the to the board either collectively or you as individuals I also consider part of my evaluation how you feel about your own productivity so um for example I look over the the board's survey of you know you do a self assessment every year and I look I look through that what's what's the board consider its accomplishments

2:37:05 how do you how do you think you're operating um I know I report to you but I also look at this board as an extension of of what we do and what I do um and so that is also feedback that I take um take personally so I think commissioner Brown I'm comfortable with what I'm hearing and and also I'm not hearing a we want to measure you on how many public you know neighborhood meetings you you attend next year um um and and so I'm comfortable at this point questions or comments and I appreciate the

2:37:54 people all right do you what you mean it sounds like we're not really changing the criteria and I think that was the question for today right yeah we're not proposing a change in criteria for next year or Motion in that direction just clarifying that President McCrae if there is something that comes up in this process that we work on between now and March um there there are things that we could apply to the 2024 revieww I'm I don't think it's in the general manager's best interest to say well you you past January you've lost your chance to uh to make amendments for 2024 so if there's something that we discover in

2:38:39 this process that's um that's something that we can adapt to sake there wasn't ask for some feedback training or two on ones and then I heard something to counter that do we have a firm yeah that's good clarification I from my perspective a couple of us could do it and not everybody has to do that but we could you know talk with you about how do we provide feedback most effectively so you'd like to do that I'm interested and we could do a two onone if anybody else is interested they can contact you k or Frank anything else next

2:39:37 item so once again um president MRA Commissioners uh good evening Frank Lawson and um have to acknowledge and look over at at Andy you want you come up this is this is safe over here um you don't have to say anything normally uh we do a policy review in December uh we had a lot on the agenda in December and we also did not have any turnover in Commissioners uh this year and so um we we decided to push this to January um you did receive uh a packet of information um this is part of a of a process that is identified in board policy by

2:40:23 practice we've started started doing this on an annual basis um to take the opportunity for the for the board to discuss um your policies that that guide um myself the organization uh and and yourselves there are a lot of board policies uh generally grouped um by by governance by linkage with with staff and the organization strategic directives and then some specific ones that that guide um some of our financial decisions um that are part of this review you did receive a Redline as part of the packet where we've gone through all of the policies and

2:41:09 provided um some uh staff recommendations uh for your consideration we also like to take the opportunity to identify some of the policies that have had specific either changes or our new policies for example in 2023 uh the board um developed um and worked in some cases throughout the the previous year and 2023 around a resiliency policy as well as a diversity equity and in inclusion policy those are probably just a little bit preliminary to review their effectiveness given um the board's just recent development

2:41:54 development on those from a from a highlights perspective um there are a few sort of noteworthy suggestions um one of them has to do with the consolidation of two specific policies around um property use and and the public Plaza lyd kns Park incorporating that into our real property policies we do uh by the way and and sort of off to the the right hand side of of this slide one of the things that I wanted to point out to Commissioners and and this doesn't just happen in in this particular case but um the organization is responsible for

2:42:41 implementing your guidance through policy we have have our own operational policies and and um fortunately we didn't have to create an example we actually had an example that's in your packet around how we take a board policy and Implement that and deploy that into the organization this was this was an example where we have some what we're proposing as high level board directives around real property and then we we take that and we Implement that and we procedu eyesee that know if that's a word we make procedure um so that we can implement the guidance of the board and we we have that on a number of different policies um not just that one but that's that's a

2:43:27 good example where we can say we're trying to consolidate this but we are implementing and here's here's the example of how we're implementing that there a number you know under gl7 this is par parliamentary procedures uh we provided some clarification one one of the things that we struggled with and the example was the integrated resource plan was it it acknowledged so um there were certain things that requires resolution from the board for approval an integrated resource plan was listed in the roster of of those things um but there were aspects we it was the word adoption and so we we clarified a definition around adoption in this case

2:44:13 to acknowledge that there's sometimes a lot of analytical results that the board doesn't necessarily want to dive in and and you know ensure the accuracy of the model so you want to acknowledge that that work was done and then approve the actions associated with that outcome so the the word adoption was was part of that uh further definition that that we as as staff felt like it was important to clarify um there's certain things associated with the the delegation to the general manager this this was um a clarification that that that I wanted to make around the fact that um the board

2:44:59 provides governance and guidance and oversight and then make it really clear that it's the general manager's job to to implement that guidance um through various other operational policies and there was some some clarification that we wanted to make uh around that just to to clarify that because that does come up when we oftentimes when we talk about policies it's like well how are we going to implement this well it's it's the general manager's job to implement that policy and create the mechanisms to do that um I think that the the tagline associated with the goals for example tried to reiterate that we are going to accomplish these goals in 2024 but we're

2:45:45 going to do it under the the guidance and the governance and the sideboards with board policy values Etc that provides the guidance for how we're how we're going to accomplish that we wanted want to clarify that um a few areas of of Technology adaptation relative to public meetings we also want the opportunity to start implementing some of the Dei into public meetings and recognize that um we do have some technology we're going to change uh in in this room um we also there's there's a few things and and I'll say that there's a there's a couple policies um in particular gp17 we think needs some

2:46:30 more work the title of that right now is board use of email it's really board use of electronic um media and I'll and I'll give you an example if we're sitting here in this room and we're talking about EB things and you get a text message from somebody that you're interacting with on an eweb issue technically that's public record even though it's your text message or if you're texting each other during the course of a meeting that's in essence public record so there's some things that we need to clarify around that um just so that the board is clear um and you know we're all clear on what's a public record and and what isn't in in

2:47:16 the case of electronic communications um I have the same thing um in fact if if there's something that happens in the field and Rod s sends sends me a text message then um I have the habit of I'll record that and and I'll email that to an as just part of the public record it was a it was an EB issue it came up it was a text message that I received so there's some updates um to that particular um board policy that we need to make sure and we need to have legal review and there's just just some some work there um and so and there's a few that are are retiring because they're either being Consolidated or I I did want to

2:48:01 back up to number one just for a second um there is something we're paying attention to when it comes to real property and that's what's called recreational immunity um this has been an issue that has been in the courts there was a a ruling I think it was last June where a government agency who had opened up their property uh for recreational use was being sued and that lawsuit was upheld that they were liable um even though they historically um the legislature has tried to um create the opportunity for public agencies to do that this this in particular is happening I think there was an issue on

2:48:46 the coast um that that drove that um Jason has let me know that there's some movement in the legislature for a legislative REM remedy to that statute it may occur over the course of a year or two but that's something that we are keeping in mind when we look at our real property policies that's just a a Nuance um to that as far as next steps um we'd like to get discussion and feedback this evening if there's um issues or areas or gaps that you see or some of the edits that you might feel uncomfortable with or are comfortable with um we would incorporate those um potentially for

2:49:32 approval either consent calendar or an agenda item in February and then like I said there's a few that will uh require some additional revision that we may not might not make within that time time frame but our our goal would be to listen this evening um and get your feedback on the the detail as we presented it and and then um see if there's other things that we need to provide you as a board to facilitate any updates that you need and I and I do have to acknowledge an's work in this um she has all of these memorized by line by word so if you have any detail questions I'm just going to look to my

2:50:17 right and and an will um be able to answer these so I want to thank an work on this m back to Carlson and then Brown um I had a few questions so on the email electronic communication policy I didn't see any changes so when do we think that we would come back in oh as I was writing my note you popped up the next slide um I wanted to note that I agreed with the consolidation of the different policies and how that was put together some of those are just outdated not useful anymore so I appreciate the work that take goes down um I had a question about the there was a change about how

2:51:05 long we hold records for before it just said that we would hold them and now it says specifically for a 12-year retention and I wanted to find out if that was that number came from something specific if that's a requirement at the state level the EG's office or or something that nature yeah so our minutes have always been a permanent record and in the past when we used to do full minutes those were retained on the website for 12 years and there was um you might remember back to when we first started recording the meetings and at the time um the board decided that they wanted to keep those recordings on the website for at least 12 years well

2:51:51 now that we've switched to action minutes we really need to clean up the language just to be more clear to say that now that we're doing action minutes we need that recording as part of the permanent record otherwise the minutes are incomplete so we're just cleaning it up to say that the video will also be retained permanently and it'll be on the website at least 12 years but probably more okay so we will still maintain it it's just the availability of it on the website may change it may not when we hit that time frame which is a number of years in the future now right originally it came um because of space constraints but I don't think that's an issue now that we've moved to a new

2:52:36 platform and I really appreciated the non to our Dei policy and the updates from she to there yeah on the real property I just question I I know that the majority of the hiking trails on the or has been closed because of that Court ruling because of the liability and I don't think the short session is going to get to it if they don't we have a backup in the interim to protect ourselves to like we have the campground at Carmen we've got Lloyd Knox we've got a lot of Hing Trail at Walterville and all the BMS on I mean the BMS on leeber and Walterville are totally open for somebody trips and we get devil Su that we have a plan or have we thought about what happens if they don't Rectify that according we've

2:53:24 certainly thought about it I don't I don't know about a specific plan look at look at Rod I I do know in my conversation this afternoon with Jason he felt like it was something with that they would at least initially try to cover in the short session um but again it's a short session so not not quite sure about um that's where is com around probably two phases to this one would be a simple sort of cleanup and then the second one would be kind of a totally rised statute um but the legislature there um I believe it was pansky who was on the appropriate committee to make

2:54:09 that happen so he was encouraged that something would happen this year now I think we do need to look at this I know we're looking at it legally right now but we need to look at this from a planning perspective R and Rod if you have anything and maybe I know Ann's been working on this too you go first R and I'll chime in and there's anything that I learned at the meeting last week yeah short short story on the situation is as Frank talked about we're working with e go to come up with our best plan forward but really the the change in the the interpretation of the rules is that um instead of just a a facto filter up front uh more cases are going to go to court so this doesn't

2:54:55 prevent um make any real changes in you anybody really wanting to Sue or litigate so U but that doesn't mean there isn't some best practices uh and some things that that we can do pretty quickly and immediately so um we'll be uh implementing some tactical changes around these these areas um but we are also kind of waiting on the final froma that to make sure we're in our best position that we can thank you have some guidance from Council in a couple of weeks so we may be able to bring that to you next month it's my understanding the laws are the same what is changed is there were some nuances to

2:55:40 the interpretation and it boils down to the purpose of the use and whether it's recreational or if it's a means of getting through a property to get to the other side to recreate and so there's things we can do within our policies and within our signages that will help mitigate and part of um what an mentioned there was um who decides that interpretation um at at the latest ruling was that who whoever was the recreator was deciding the purpose that they were there um and that's what the the Court ruled um but the one of the initial legislative fixes will be is

2:56:25 that whoever is the property owner will determine what the appropriate usage is and so more to come on that for other comments or questions on yeah R and then it just goes to the electronic communication I'm sure that this will get flushed out as we learn more but the example was given that if we get a text while we're in this meeting it's a public record and if I get a text from a constituent regarding an ewb thing is that as well a public record then I mean and that's probably will get flushed out in this march to April it it'll it'll

2:57:10 get flushed out um there is a different whether you're in this meeting acting on P behalf or not in this meeting uh at the time so for example two Commissioners can can talk to each other about eweb issues um in a non- quorum basis but when you're here you're in a quorum okay and so if you are being influenced by somebody in that role in a quorum there's some interpretation there but that will all be flushed out as as part of this because there are some some some nuances to that so that that that will be right we want to be able to protect Commissioners in your role so

2:57:57 that you're not violating any sort of Ethics um or other law uh from me I just want to say the edits that you proposed here and the cleanup and retirement of policies all make sense I appreciate that anything else you need from us I don't think so we we appreciate your feedback if if there's things that do come to mind Commissioners here course of the particular the next month or when we have our oneon-one checkins you'll agree to get those to

2:58:42 us happy to those appreciate your feedback we know that this is not the most exciting thing that you you have on your plate um but next to telling the general manager what to do how how much work going to be so thanks thanks for your feedback thanks some future board agendas you going to walk us through that the um the only thing that I will add is that there there are two um

2:59:27 upcoming information sessions on the 22nd and the 25th they were not in the board Agenda Report those are at the Amazon community center they are College Hill information centers uh the one on the 22nd is from 11:30 to 1 in the afternoon the one on the 25th is from 6:30 to 7:30 um in particular that's that's your area commissioner mcra um those are general information sessions um for the for the public on the status of College Hill hilard Community Center what did I say you said Amazon just oh Hillard yes the Hillyard Community Center in Amazon Park 2830 Bard Street staff send an invite to

3:00:15 us yeah we'll make sure that we get you an invite that was the only thing I had to add to the Bry um a question there's a tenative work session in February on the 20th that were to happen I would be out of town yeah I think there's two Commissioners that would miss miss that and so and I didn't have anything imminently on the docket for that um we do if if there is an item um Mr president vice president when we're doing our agenda planning I I think right now the the agenda for February is relatively light

3:01:00 March tends to be is a little bit heavy generally so if there was something that we needed more time for we could we could allocate more time in February but I'm I'm not I don't have anything imminently on that that docket if we want to take that off the agenda we can I propose we take it off just so others aren't anticipated either unless anybody's poos February 20th placeholder all I did you get that to remove it y the only thing I wanted to bring up on agendas was was actually um looking ahead at November meet this first Tuesday and that's an election year and this could again be a potentially

3:01:47 contentious year and I just wondered if we may want to not hold thoughts on that um typically we would either do the next day or we could do the next week um I I would propose probably the next week so the the following Tuesday after that not everybody will have the smooth transition of power that we had this evening um and unless we find some kind of conflict we'll propose um to Commissioners that we simply move it delay it one week to the

3:02:33 following Tuesday if if that sounds reasonable now we're everybody at this point given what you know about your calendar in November recognizing things might come up but if that seems workable we'll go that rout for now all right so buming that one back a week thank agendas um I don't know how you all feel I Mindy and I have both been proponents of larger number of meanings that are a little bit shorter folks are meanful to that is that something that you're open to prefer not to do that' be the way I'd

3:03:18 be inclined to go but I don't want to close that on others like John Brown help me what you just said um how do you feel about more work sessions they spread out our time together into more meetings that are shorter instead of meetings that go till 9: well Logistics I mean to me the logistics of dying up three nights a week or a month versus one yeah is doesn't work as good for me as it does this one because you know right now I've got first Tuesday of every month walk down everything else and then if you do that and you comp complicate that with vacations and work and all those other things um we not to I my vote would not to be to do that because I mean it's kind of like

3:04:03 mobilization you you get staff ready and and Boards ready and they know what to do if they got to do something every other week um I'd defer to management see what see what that would do to stop and deficiencies and more more more meetings because just because they're supposed to be shorter doesn't mean they are shorter and we got some pretty heavy lifting coming up well have a lot of public inut yeah uh Sonia and then John and Frank I'm if there is a month here and there um that we need to have it because we have you know very large lar agenda or we have something that's very needy that requires other public

3:04:48 input um you know this flash couple of years have been really full so you know I I think it made sense for that but if we can do that I would appreciate it because I have so few nights with my family at this point that um another meeting where I don't get time is um for me I like to do a work session on like I said on a Mei topic where it's um a one topic work session right and I I can foresee that because I three minutes on

3:05:33 some of these things just isn't enough and I can foresee the conversation coming up this year on rate design being one of those ones where it might be good to have just this is a dedicated work session on raid design so that it's more free flowing and more uh in depth so that I can get what I we need on this not 15 minutes of of of a staff presentation and one round of three minutes that to me are the type of work sessions that I would be in favor of but just to just to have shorter board meetings and do two you know split this meeting into two me meetings I'm not for that but on meeting subjects very helpful for me great and I

3:06:20 just saw head on the work session uh support for that I was going to say um it's topical if if there's an issue that um and it it's not just the amount of time I think what becomes valuable staff is to hear the board debate and to hear different perspectives and and Commissioners act you know interact it's not just interacting with staff on a on a presentation or a Q&A but it's here's something to truly wrestle with the pros and cons of and we we can lay this out

3:07:05 as step but there are times when Commissioners need to deliberate amongst yourselves and so um rate design is is probably a good example of that there may be some others that that we would want to take the opportunity to do that but from a staff perspective I think it's more topical than it is um workload or effort it's all workload or effort but I I think where it makes the most sense is where we would get the most value is is where there's a mey subject where there's a deliberation that's needed I agree I definitely think it's tropical and I also want to um put a plugin occasionally as appropriate those two on meetings that we've had a few of

3:07:51 them this past year and to me those have been really helpful again I know it's a lot of Staff time but um it just provides us with a lot of background information that we can he talking about it in a and I'll I'll say that that staff gets a lot out of those as well it's an opportunity for staff to sit down with Commissioners and and have an exchange of information this is this is not just over your absorption it's it's a chance for staff to interact with Commissioners on an individual or or small group basis and there's probably a combination of things and since you brought up rate design there might be some background material where we meet

3:08:38 two on-one with different rate Design Concepts and then the board can deliber more as a group in a in a work session so um I I think while while it's work I I think also there's a lot of benefit to staff to have those one-on-one two-on-one kind of interactions and so we'll continue to to use that um as we need to going forward and sounds like the board's receptive to that the challenge is coordinating all your schedules but I don't personally have to deal with that so I don't what your evaluate I guess I'll deal with it from now on yeah items on future board

3:09:29 [Music] candidates do sorry I didn't bring this up earlier so I've heard R and the city that uh the city's looking for new sources of revenue I you on your schedule that you have a meeting with Mader and others in leadership the city and if there's any um efforts by City leadership and others to utility tax or anything to affect our bill I would hope that we could bring that to the board soon as possible because I think that's something at least for me that would be very important and very U challenging for me to to accept so if that's a true rumor I I know that's on your schedule but I don't know it just talks about billing and so I don't know if that's a a hidden message or what but I just would like to know where you you don't

3:10:16 have to tell me what it's about but if it is something about billing I don't know all the details of what it's about commissioner I I do know that uh the the city has approached the subject I think it was with our last leadership meeting that the city is looking for different sources of revenue eweb is an option as a billing agent for that um I can tell this this board that that is not not a decision that I would I would make that I would defer that ultimate decision to this board um the discussion may be around the mechanics of what that would look like but um I don't know all those details but that's the general subject of it um but I would bring whatever

3:11:02 request that the city makes of us regarding anything that affects our our bill um I would bring back to this board yeah because I'm you just said that you guys have talked about it before and I this is the first I've heard of it I would hope that the liaison with the city would would inform the rest of the board whether it be an executive session or not because I think this got that's going to be huge and they tried to do things that'll affect the bill because we have you know we have a lot we have thousands of customers that aren't in the city and we have it's just a and I I know they've tried to do this before when I say before it's been on or off for years yeah so that that's what I say before and and we know that that there's um a revenue committee that is

3:11:49 looking at different options so I I would the message to this group is that if there's something that the city requests that affects the the ewb bill that I would bring that that to this board I really appreciate that thank you put way over here today um on the radio I heard that jlcc is doing some future story or interview tomorrow at 2 o' I think I don't know if it's aring tomorrow or I think that's the one that Aaron orlovski already did so it's probably aring tomorrow so I think it has to do with a number of different

3:12:37 subjects it's probably true yeah and just going to commissioner br's comment um I sit on Revenue committee that it's it's not a revenue committee it's the city manager gathering information on Revenue options and that's where it's at at this point as far as it being brought to us in our leaon it was brought up in that meeting so if that were we would report it to you it's it was after that that it's being put out there and and the city is in a is in a financial situation that they need to address and they're looking at every option on the table and so that's that's the level it's at now um it may come you know I mean I think that the discussion that

3:13:23 will be had between Frank and Sarah um is just putting that out there that there is a discussion out there one of the things that that may involve would be eweb as a partner or not and I I think that yes we would want to weigh in on that and uh and that would be that absolutely appropriate but it it wasn't something that was brought up and we haven't haven't brought to this boort apprciate that I just have uh one question I know that a couple months ago we had a fair amount of conversation about um federal agencies discussing our license with the um Carmen Smith project and feels like that was fairly well resolved in terms

3:14:08 of EB providing writ comment um back to firk and we saw that which is super helpful um I just want to stay alert that feels like it has a potential to um be a big issue and so if there are other Communications from federal agencies to other federal agencies about e web I personally would be interested in seeing it just so that I suspect we all would just so we're aware of what's being um any accusations are being leveled Etc or any Clarity or resolution yeah president McCrae we will keep the board informed as things develop on that front I think I did

3:14:53 provide the board the the heads up that the Salem newspaper is doing an article on that um with with some updates there um but as as meetings um and determinations and negotiations continue will continue to keep the board apprised as as things happen so and that that may be in the form of of emails or or other correspondents but your your request is noted any else president M then quick followup to commissioner Carlson's question about the move in to the downtown um office um

3:15:39 I consulted my Julie M notes and it's looks like we're scheduled to move in in June and the other thing um somebody alluded to the Dropbox the cheap drop box that's getting replaced uh sometime next week uh with the more Stout version like we have out here and I don't know Rod if we did can't recall that we did have a a vandalism issue yes um with that a month ago yeah it was the Dropbox actually in the building and somebody we got the person prosecuted was the one in the building not the one outside of the building well

3:16:24 it's the one on the the drop box that sits out by the road it was the one on the outside of the building yeah they yeah right TR done all